Talk:Vladimir Putin
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Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 March 2024[edit]
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Please change the tense of the section about the The 2020 Khabarovsk Krai protests to be past tense. The protests ended several years ago. See 2020–2021 Khabarovsk Krai protests Uhoj (talk) 12:38, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
Done PianoDan (talk) 21:21, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
Incorrect info on Putin's job in the 1990s[edit]
"chief of the Main Control Directorate of the Presidential Property Management Department (until June 1998)" – this is incorrect. Should be "chief of the Main Control Directorate of the Presidential Administration (until June 1998)"
He worked (as deputy) in Presidential Property Management Department and later as head of the Main Control Directorate of the Presidential Administration of Russia (these days, "Main" is dropped from the name), not the Main Control Directorate of the Presidential Property Management Department (which is still called "Main"). These are two different offices.
I posted once before, but to no avail. Loquens homo (talk) 12:07, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
- @Loquens homo Would you mind providing a reliable source to support this translation and/or provide more details about these two offices? I'll be happy to make that edit, but we cannot do that without a source. Pavel Borodin's page also uses the same name. Ppt91talk 21:00, 2 April 2024 (UTC)
- Sure, it is confusing indeed. First, here are these two units, they still exist:
- - unit in Presidential Administration: http://en.kremlin.ru/structure/administration/departments#department-1006
- - unit in Presidential Property Management Department:
- https://udprf.ru/en/content/main-control-directorate
- https://udprf.ru/en/obshchie-svedeniya/structure#:~:text=Main%20control%20directorate
- Just to underscore the scope of the difference: the latter is essentially inspector general of one government department (the one in charge of e.g. president's residents, transportation, etc.). The former is inspector general for the entirety of Russian federal government.
- Next, note that, since 1993 or 1995, Presidential Property Management Department is not part of the Presidential Administration; it's a separate federal agency instead: https://udprf.ru/en#:~:text=It%20became%20an%20independent%20federal%20executive%20body%20governed%20by%20the%20President%20of%20the%20Russian%20Federation. Borodin was its head until 2000.
- Also note that the unit in Presidential Administration had an adjective "Main" in its name in 1996-2004 (i.e. units in two different agencies had identical names), but lost it since. That's probably is the key source of confusion:
- - Putin did work (in 1996-97) at Presidential Property Management Department (as Borodin's deputy)
- - Putin worked (in 1997-98) at the Main Control Directorate of the Presidential Administration (as the chief of directorate) at the time when it had an identical name to the unit of Presidential Property Management Department.
- Link to official bio.
- (And on top of all that, there are translation issues, for example English page of Presidential Property Management Department is Directorate of the President of the Russian Federation, while on its webpage it is called the Administrative Directorate of the President of the Russian Federation.)
- It is important, because Presidential Property Management Department, while influential, is not set up to be a political organization that exercises power. All units of Presidential Administration are exercising power, so Putin's move from the former to the latter was a move to a more political and more powerful job. Loquens homo (talk) 19:27, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
Early life and Putin's CV[edit]
According to a detailed account in the Economist on 10 June 2023, Putin's life story until his late teens is completely falsified. The article was published on the occasion of the death of his mother on 31 May 2023, aged 97, who lived as a poor Russian peasant woman in Metechi, Georgia, where Putin was born and went to school. The article is based on research by two Western journalists from 2003 who have soon later been died by the KGB in „accidents“. -- The least that should be said here at Wiki is that there are doubts about Putin's CV. -- I can send the Economist article as a jpg file if required. If you are interested, please leave your address here. 2003:EA:F43:1811:B0E4:D76A:4DC7:2FB8 (talk) 16:47, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 April 2024[edit]
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Kindly insert/change the initial description at the top of the page to reflect that Vladimir Putin is a “genocidal tyrant dictator” between the description “politician” and “former intelligence officer”. 120.136.57.237 (talk) 07:16, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
- Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the
{{Edit extended-protected}}
template. — Czello (music) 07:31, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
Putin's connection to New Zealand[edit]
I have been researching this story for several years.
Putin's presence in New Zealand as a KGB agent in the 1980s has not been corroborated through any government records that I am aware of, as the article claims (and there is no evidence of this in any of the sources cited). David Lange did not allege Putin "served" in New Zealand; the source cited for this is former Waitakere Mayor Bob Harvey's recollection of a flippant remark Lange made to him decades ago about whether Putin had visited New Zealand as a young man (“Of course, why wouldn’t he?”).
On Bob Harvey's claims:
Two of the three sources cited in this section relate to the unfounded claims of Bob Harvey that first appeared in Metro magazine and were later reported by other media outlets such as the New Zealand Herald. I have researched all the claims in the article and found most to be false, such as his speaking to a judoka in Wellington who claimed to have trained with Putin in a dojo on Cuba Street (there has never been a judo club on Cuba Street and I have found no record of the man he claims to have spoken to, a "Jako Milne", ever existing). The "eyewitness accounts" the Wikipedia article cites were mostly made up by Harvey.
I also spoke to Helen Clark (one of, if not the only, person in this story to have actually met Putin) and she roundly rejects all of Harvey's claims, including that Putin had some love interest in her. Harvey, generally, is an unreliable source. He once claimed former Prime Minister Norman Kirk was killed by the CIA.
The third source relates to a book about the expulsion of Soviet diplomat Sergei Budnik and claims a man resembling Putin was in New Zealand at the time, based on photographs and vision from an old television programme. These are available online and that man is in all likelihood not Putin (significantly older and with different facial morphology).
Could this section of the article pleased be removed or simply revised to say claims have been made about Putin's possible presence in NZ in the 80s? AidanWellington (talk) 11:31, 6 May 2024 (UTC)
Deciding what we will change his portrait to after his death[edit]
I know this is too early to discuss, as Putin is in good health currently, but I think we can get ahead of the curve and discuss pictures that are appropriate to use in the infobox following his death. There are a quite a large number of photos on Commons (mostly from Kremlin.ru).
Suggestions on what to change the portrait to after his death are open and you can also reply to designate your support for using that image. I'm not exactly sure which one best would represent him, but I think that this talk page would be the best place to find people who would have an idea about what photo would be best. Duke of New Gwynedd (talk | contrib.) 12:46, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
- This is too early to discuss. Acroterion (talk) 12:53, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
- (ec) Putin's health is ambiguous[1] at best; it's believed that his bodily waste is collected to prevent the west from collecting and studying it to determine his health.[2] There is no reason to think his death is imminent, though, so isn't this premature? 331dot (talk) 12:56, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 29 May 2024[edit]
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Could someone change the p in President in the intro to a capital P. AutisticAndrew (talk) 10:36, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
............[edit]
Don't think it should mention stalin in the lead HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 10:18, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Why? — Czello (music) 10:19, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Because he shouldn't be mentioned. He was a disgusting dictator that had like 100 million people killed, more than Hitler. And Stalin has nothing to do with Putin, Putin wasn't a Soviet dictator like Stalin. This this should be removed instantly HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 21:02, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- @HumansRightsIsCool The comment relates to how long each was leader of Russia. How evil Stalin was is irrelevant. — Czello (music) 21:42, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Stalin wasnt even the leader of Russia he was the leader of the Soviet Union, a different country. Mentioning Stalin is stupid. HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 21:52, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Well, it does say "Russian or Soviet" as there is a great deal of overlap there. — Czello (music) 07:14, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Can you please just remove it or put it somewhere else in the page where its not the lead. This is bothering me. It makes this perfect page terrible HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 07:28, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- @HumansRightsIsCool It's notable and relevant information, don't see why it shouldn't be in the lead. This seems to just be an WP:IDONTLIKEIT argument. — Czello (music) 07:45, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- Can you please just remove it or put it somewhere else in the page where its not the lead. This is bothering me. It makes this perfect page terrible HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 07:28, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
- Well, it does say "Russian or Soviet" as there is a great deal of overlap there. — Czello (music) 07:14, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Stalin wasnt even the leader of Russia he was the leader of the Soviet Union, a different country. Mentioning Stalin is stupid. HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 21:52, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- @HumansRightsIsCool The comment relates to how long each was leader of Russia. How evil Stalin was is irrelevant. — Czello (music) 21:42, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Because he shouldn't be mentioned. He was a disgusting dictator that had like 100 million people killed, more than Hitler. And Stalin has nothing to do with Putin, Putin wasn't a Soviet dictator like Stalin. This this should be removed instantly HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 21:02, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
Crimes[edit]
These are the crimes Vladimir Putin has committed: war crimes, mass murder, attempted genocide, mass destruction of property, mass kidnapping, mass child abductions, persecution, oppression, human rights violations, invasion, discrimination, corruption, forced displacement, crimes against humanity, espionage, electoral fraud, propaganda, state terrorism, mass censorship, abuse of power, tyranny, torture, animal cruelty, pollution, organized crime, violations of international law, unlawful imprisonments, abuse, child abuse, brainwashing, coercion, extortion, looting, illegal annexations, mutilation, forced disappearances, assault, hate crimes, fraud 187.161.132.88 (talk) 21:47, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
- Yeah, but he never claimed porn-star hush-money was business expenses. So he can't be all bad. And not sure about the animal cruelty. Martinevans123 (talk) 07:21, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
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